r/interestingasfuck • u/The_Love-Tap • 22h ago

Germany has more castles than the United States has McDonald’s. This is the Eltz castle, located in Wiershem. It has been owned and occupied by the same family for 33 generations over 800 years

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u/Ricordis 20h ago edited 17h ago

Germany also had lots of "Zollfestungen". Those were fortified towers at rivers with a chain spun across the river and if you wanted to pass you had to pay a toll.

Those things are also considered as castle in english and there were maaany of these in Germany as it was splintered down to small kingdoms before which means there were many borders.

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u/jeffroxs101 19h ago edited 19h ago

That's called a pair of towers and a chain, maybe a fortification not a castle. English isn't the language struggling to express what these buildings are, German is. That's not a castle in English if you have a pair of towers and a chain no English speaker would describe it as a castle.

*Regarding the other "castles". A pile of rocks is called rubble, a pile of rocks that used to be a castle is called a ruin. Not a castle. None of the things Germans apply the word castle to seem to be castles beside the handful that are actually castles. They teach English in Germany in school so I don't see how you don't understand this.

Just because a castle used to be there hundreds or thousands of years ago doesn't mean it is still a castle. That's just a pile of rocks guy.

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u/MethodicallyRight 18h ago

You're treating the English category 'castle' as though it has a one-to-one correspondence with the German category you're translating. It doesn't. German distinguishes Burg, Festung, Schloss, Ruine, etc., and those categories have historically overlapping boundaries that don't map cleanly onto English. German also has very productive compound nouns for specifying subtypes. So if a German source classifies a structure as a Burg, you can't establish that the classification is wrong merely by saying an English speaker wouldn't call the surviving structure a castle. You'd have to examine what the structure actually was and what German historical terminology means by Burg in that context.

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u/jeffroxs101 18h ago

A thousand year old castle that is now a field with rocks on it is not a fortification nor a castle. It should be renamed something besides burg.

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u/Ricordis 18h ago

Yeah, that's a "Burgruine" [castle ruin].

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u/jeffroxs101 17h ago

Appropriate and accurate. I support it, I don't support people pretending every Burg is a castle because English translators are slow in the head and claim it to just be a burg.

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u/MethodicallyRight 18h ago

A thousand year old castle that is now a field with rocks on it is not a fortification nor a castle. It should be renamed something besides burg.

They do... It's called a 'Burgstall'

Great point, people who misuse German words and terminology are wrong ... Brilliant.

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u/jeffroxs101 18h ago

A shack that the homeowner once fought off home invaders in is also, not a burg or castle regardless of calling it a burg.

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u/Ricordis 18h ago

You literally defined the word "Burg".

A "Burg" is a fortified, inhabitable structure, built to provide protection and serve as a residency for a noble, mostly originating in medieval times.

You just offered a perfect example of how the english definition of a castle differs from the german definition and while there's a direct translation for that word it still has different meanings.

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u/Ricordis 19h ago

Yeah, I was not precise enough by skipping some steps.

Those toll towers are still considered a fortress/castle after german standards but maybe not by what a non-german might think a castle is. But still it gets counted as castle and warps the view.

In german it's far easier to separate those castle types as german grammar simply allows to create composite words and there you can create new words for every subtype of castle easily.

I know the english language is capable of doing so with separate words but as this is a different type of thinking linked to a different culture and language it's not used as much.

Back to castles: Every little reinforced whatever belongs to the category of a "Burg" in Germany, even those just made of wood, consisting of just a tower and a palisade. It doesn't quite fit the english definition of a castle.

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u/MethodicallyRight 19h ago

Good on you for being patient and good faith in your response. The other user is being a dick'

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u/jeffroxs101 19h ago

I know German is an old language and I even took 3 years of it but it seems silly to not just invent new words when the words you have don't accurately describe things. Hell, Shakespeare literally just made up shit and we accepted it and those words are now in the English Vernacular. Languages are all made up! Just make more words! No one can stop you. I was irritated by the language struggling to adapt, not at you particularly. I apologize if I came across as rude or hostile.

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u/LifeIsSoup-ImFork 18h ago

we invent new words on the daily, theyre called compound-words and there is nothing you cant describe using them.

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u/jeffroxs101 18h ago

And I love them! That is why I don't get why anyone would refer to a pile of rocks as a castle when they can call it pile-of-rocks-that-used-to-be-a-castle in German! The language is capable of differentiating between a castle and a pile of rubble.

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u/_kaidu_ 17h ago

What you are saying doesn't make any sense. What we are calling a "Burg" is a medieval fortress. They are by definition old and are nowadays a "pule of rocks" except for the cases were they were rebuilt or renovated or for the few really big fortress built in late medieval. The thing is: nobody built Burgen anymore after the medieval period cause it was not cery pleasant to live there. Instead, people built a Schloss. In english language both is called a castle which adds to the confusion here. We have a word for castles that are destroyed: Burgruine (Castle ruins). The distinction here, though, is not between intact castles and castle ruins. A castle ruin can look very impressive and many of them are worth a visit. Also, most ruins still have an intact tower or something, they are not just a pile of rocks. What some people point out is that 1. castles in Germany can come in very different sizes. A count who owned just a tiny piece of land won't have been able to build a huge castle. Some castles are very tiny and the example in the picture is already a impressive one 2. Schloss is a very broad term. Some of them are rather large buildings, others are palaces. Not all of them have towers and the fewest of them have walls (they are not fortresses)

Nevertheless, I don't doubt that Germany has A LOT of such Burg and Schloss buildings.

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u/LifeIsSoup-ImFork 17h ago

pile-of-rocks-that-used-to-be-a-castle in German!

we do tho, the word youre looking for is burgruine. which is different from a burg thats not a ruine.

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u/sick_stuff1 18h ago

but german does have words for them??

Burg gets called castle in english, even tho its not a castle. its the english that don't have a word for it.

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u/jeffroxs101 18h ago

Then they shouldn't be referred to as castles now should they? Use accurate language to describe the things around you regardless of language. A ruin is a ruin, regardless of being a castle 1000 years ago. Rubble is rubble when it is a pile of rocks. These are not called castles by anyone with any sense.

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u/sick_stuff1 18h ago

Then they shouldn't be referred to as castles now should they?

tell the english? we aren't calling them that.

we even have a specific word for medieval fortress that are ruins, they are called "Burgruinen"

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u/jeffroxs101 18h ago

Beautiful I love it, and fine. I'll hate the British even harder, thank you for encouraging me lmao.

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u/jeffroxs101 18h ago

Burg = castle, stronghold, citadel, fortification. A pile of rocks is not a Burg. Do I need to break out a thesaurus? If everything in Germany is a Burg, then nothing in Germany is a Burg. Describe individual and unique buildings with separate words instead of labeling everything a Burg. It is German that is struggling to describe locations and buildings.

A school, is a school. Just because you name the hospital a school, the mortuary a school, the grocery store as a school, does not make them all schools. By technicality yes! People can learn anywhere, but that's not what the fucking word school means just because your ancestors are lazy at naming things or updating the words used to describe them.

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u/Ricordis 18h ago edited 17h ago

It's weird how you try to argue with native speakers about their own language. After reading your comments I came to the conclusion you simply do not understand the concept of compound words and subcategories.

A castle is a castle, a stronghold a stronghold, a fortress a fortress.

In german they are a "Burg" and if you need to be precise you make a compound word of it: Kirchenburg, Reichsburg, Trutzburg, Hochburg, Hügelburg, Wasserburg, Fluchtburg, Ritterburg, Grenzburg, Zwillingsburg, Zollburg, Kernburg, Vorburg, Felsenburg, Spornburg, Talburg, ...

We are not the ones who need more words to define a castle.

I can even work with your school example. We have Schule, Berufsschule, Ärzteschule, Fahrschule, Tauchschule, ... so yeah, a shack at the beach with a scuba coach is a "Schule" [school].

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u/jeffroxs101 17h ago edited 17h ago

I do understand compound words. Calling 5 different structures "burg" is still silly and pointless. You've proven the language is flexible and you can name things accurately. 5 different types of buildings should not be called burg regardless if you are able to specify it down further by using the more detailed or accurate terms.

Am I a burg if I hold off invaders? Are you a burg? Is the Tesco down the street a burg? Or are there accurate names for these things we can use that actually describe said locations, people, or objects?

*By your language and standards I could claim there are 500,000 burgs in America. Most are house shaped. And lived in like houses, but it's a burg. Just a burg-with-people-living-inside-that-doesn't-defend-nor-protect-anyone and that is a normal word in German. I love the compound words I have learned in German, that doesn't mean using short hand to describe a fucking barn as a castle is sensible. "It protects cattle so it is a burg" the fuck? Just make a word for barn if you are struggling to describe a simple building. And it doesn't need to involve burg.

And I'll say it right now, any burger made outside of Hamburg is just a ground beef patty! Just like Chardonnay

Naming things "art school", "diving school", "tech school" that is completely normal and valid. It is a school specifying in one subject manner. That's not hard to process my guy. When your word for shack, castle, and pile of rocks is just "burg" maybe get more creative?

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u/Ricordis 15h ago

Considered the Tesco has been built in medieval times and is inhabitated by a noble and is fortified to hold off attackers: Yes, it's a "Burg".
Are you a "Burg"? No, because you can't be inhabitated.
Does America have a "Burg"? No, because America had no medieval times or nobles.

It's like I am arguing with a toddler who doesn't accept a word can have a simple meaning and is clearly defined. And you throw in stupid examples which simply do not fulfil the criterias.

There's a thought in your mind which got stuck and you simply can't get rid of it to understand. You accepted the thing with different kind of schools; why is it so hard to transfer that to "Burg"?

A barn is a "Scheune", a shack a "Schuppen" and you Hamburger-example is completely off the topic.

Again, the definition of a "Burg" is: A fortified structure built primarily during medieval times, serving as a private fortified residence for nobility.
It can be a fortified wooden tower or it can be two towers made out of stone on both sides of a river. We have different words for all of these but in the end everything is a "Burg" like a driving school, a law school are all schools. But english lacks the words for these and calls them all castles and then an english speaking person is confused why the wooden shack with a palisade is in german a castle. Because it fucking is. A "Holzburg" to be precise.

If my house would have been built 500 years ago, and I would be a noble and put barbed wire in front of my door that would make my house a "Burg". "Burg" describes a function.

That's my last attempt to explain this. If you still do not understand it I claim you are either trolling or simply can't comprehend this.