r/law • u/bendubberley_ • 15h ago

Legal News The judge in the Lindsay Clancy case is admonishing jurors who are refusing to follow his instructions

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u/DefN0TtheFB1 12h ago

Even your local grocery store has a socioeconomic bias based on where you live. Good points raised though. We exist in a bubble.

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u/sailphish 9h ago

Jury duty absolutely has an economic bias as well. Maybe not from the initial letters that get sent out, but by the time the jury is selected there are definitely filters in place.

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u/AutisticHobbit 8h ago

Eh. Kinda.

My mother was a paralegal, and growing up? Dinner table conversations were about her work, so the talk was about legal proceedings.

She never served on a jury. Neither did her boss. Not once. The refused her every time...reason being is they don't want informed people. They don't want a juror who might know things about the law, and be able to reason out things that they didn't present or catch mistakes that would otherwise go unnoticed. Both sides want...ignorant people. People who really know nothing about anything.

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u/zlaw32 4h ago

Lawyer here. That’s true most of the time, but sometimes one side will want lawyers/paralegals/(insert educated profession here) because they feel a case is overly complicated and having someone who understands and can explain to the others is beneficial

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u/AutisticHobbit 2h ago

You would know much better then me. Anecdotally, I can only say my mother never had it happen to her...and her peers reported the same general experience. Then again, it could be somewhat regional and/or that just one of those more complicated cases never came up at the same time.

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u/WhichAd366 2h ago

It’s more so that one side didn’t want your mom on the jury because they thought she would have a bias towards the other side.

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u/ainRingeck 20m ago

Also a lawyer here: Sometimes you don't want the paralegal or other lawyer on the jury because they can sway the rest of the jury more strongly by doing what I just did: saying I'm a lawyer to invoke my expertise and make you more likely to listen to my opinion on matters of law. And you can bet that if I'm the kind of lawyer one side wants, the other side will make sure to remove me from the jury pool.

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u/_my_troll_account 9h ago

Isn't it often based on drivers licensure and/or voting registration? Strikes me as a nontrivial filter.

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u/Altruistic-Piece-485 8h ago

When I served on a jury there were questions we all had to answer in the courtroom with the lawyers from each side and the judge. Most of them were to filter out anyone that had a potential connection to either side or didn't have a solid grasp of the English language but at least one asked the jurors if they thought they couldn't rule solely based on the law and the facts presented in the trial because of personally held moral or ethical reasons.

Theoretically that should filter out people that would rule based on how they 'feel' like in the comment above but in reality those people are probably too dumb to realize thats what they're being asked.

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u/PersonalityIll9476 7h ago

That's exactly what happened. That juror was like "of course I can make legal judgements" and then the next thing you know they're insisting on their feelings.

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u/richardcraniumIII 7h ago

Why don't we have Logic classes in public schools? Just kidding - the US loves to produce dumb consumers.

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u/frogf4rts123 6h ago

My kids are taught critical thinking in school thankfully. The rest of the curriculum is stupid, but that parts nice to see.

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u/adam4040 4h ago

Yeah we can definitely do without math, science, history, English. You watch YouTube videos…have done your own research.

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u/CastAside1812 5h ago

Did your kids get the COVID vaccine? Textbook critical thinking test right there.

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u/Truth_ 2h ago

It's funny because this could be asked by either side.

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u/RobutNotRobot 8h ago

Just say that you believe in the concept of jury nullification and that all cops lie and you can get dismissed from jury duty pretty quickly.

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u/richardcraniumIII 7h ago

But we need educated jury members! I'm still gonna use your idea.

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u/Impossible-Age-3302 7h ago edited 6h ago

You can be rejected if your morals prevent you from being impartial. I am categorically opposed to the death penalty, and therefore unfit to serve in those cases.

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u/EndIsrael 5h ago

That question has a dual purpose: weeding out the morons, and exposing the jurors who know what nullification is but aren't clever enough to hide it.

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u/goodbyewawona 9h ago

Also those who can afford financially to work it while being away from their normal jobs and/or have child care in place.

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u/Wild_Astronaut7090 9h ago

In MA there is paid leave for jury duty & the courts pay you something if it goes longer.

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u/goodbyewawona 9h ago

That’s good.  Sadly that is not the case in many states/jurisdictions.  When I served I believe I received about $14.00 a day.  Parking was about $6.00 a day. 

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u/SmallPurplePeopleEat 7h ago

I used to work for a notoriously shitty corporation that shockingly had an excellent jury duty policy. They paid up to 80 hours at your regular pay rate.

Literally every one of my coworkers who got summoned would happily show up. Unfortunately, they usually got dismissed almost immediately because we all worked in news.

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u/Comfortable-Mud2755 2h ago

Offers benefits it knows full well that they'll never pay out, that's a policy even Scrooge would say, come on bro?!

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u/mariaireneee 7h ago

Where I live, $14 a day would have been GENEROUS.

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u/HobomanCat 8h ago

In California Jury duty pay is $15 for the day. Less than the hourly minimum wage here.

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u/HighSeverityImpact 7h ago

And it only starts on the second day. Meaning the first day is free.

They do pay for mileage from your home to the courthouse, but that's it. It's not roundtrip. Also, it's only 36 cents per mile, not the $.72 federal mileage rate. So really it's a 1/4 of your mileage rate.

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u/blackhoodie88 6h ago

Not always. In some cities like SF they do cover if you don't get paid jury leave as a benefit however there is an income cap for jurors. In SF it's 80k, so it sucks if you have an employer that doesn't pay for extended jury duty time.

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u/ruat_caelum 8h ago

one of the easiest ways to "Get out" of jury duty is to prove you don't have transportation to the court house. Since most cities don't have FREE public transport or a system that allows REASONABLE travel time, you can be released.

There are many people who simply cannot afford in money or time to be on a jury, such "hardships" are often taken into account.

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u/Much-Earth7760 7h ago

My dad was (the way he tells it) passed over for a jury because he had 4 children and none of them had ever been arrested lmao

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u/Hal731 9h ago

I Lived in the upper west side of Manhattan and had to regularly save seemingly not brain damaged people from killing themselves on an escalator.

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u/RobutNotRobot 8h ago

Jurors are almost always selected by people registered to vote.

That's a huge filter that gets the people that barely know what country they are in and might not know who is even President.

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u/RatLabGuy 9h ago

Filtering the jury is literally the DAs job

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u/alextxdro 9h ago

I’d argue jury duty aswell, many people don’t get “mail” many others will never show up to jury duty and others will avoid it at all costs so it sort of filters those types out. While I’d consider Walmart more true, just depends which Walmart.

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u/CoachoftheYear2025 7h ago

Not a big enough one.  We're trapped in here with idiots 

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u/ThrowAwayAccountAMZN 6h ago

"We exist in a bubble" and we live in a society